this post was submitted on 26 Oct 2023
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I doubt that distinction makes any difference to the Ukrainians who are defending their country from genocidal murderers.
There are videos of conscripts voluntarily giving themselves up to the AFU. It makes a difference
The ones who were executed declined to surrender while on Ukrainian territory. They also could have refused to serve and gone to prison instead, but they didn't. These gopniks knew what they were getting involved in and they deserve what they got.
You realize you can't just go surrender, right? You will get shot in the back by the other Russians unless everyone is surrendering
Some of these are 19 year old kids, they had no idea what they were getting themselves into. If they declined to fight when they got to the front line, yes, it's too late, but it's fucked up to just straight up execute them
I'd like to think if I somehow ended up in this situation, and I knew they would just kill me for not following orders and i wasnt going to follow them, that'd I'd just kill whoever the top ranking person in the unit is who'd execute me and then kill myself.
But maybe they don't realize they'll be executed when this happens, I dunno.
Apparently that's happened, the guy who donated the helicopter had to a kill a few people to pull it off
Ya, that one's a little different as he'd already escaped in essence.
If you're in the trenches or on the front line or whatever, you aren't going to survive the mutiny.
I'd be worried about them torturing instead of killing me once I started shooting in my own people, hence the intention to kill myself after to ensure it was quick and painless.
To get to that position he had to kill the rest of the crew. Notice it was only one guy and one helicopter, nobody else came with him
I thought he killed them once they landed? I remember reading they were confused about their location before he shot them.
Oh, I missed that detail. Anyway, my point is it's not easy to just turn yourself in, you need to be a good soldier just to surrender!
I'm sure you'd feel the same way about this distinction between nice Russian occupiers and bad Russian occupiers if it was your country they were invading, your culture they were destroying, and your democratic rights they were taking away. It's incredibly naive.
If I was in that scenario, I would be more emotionally charged about the subject and rightfully so. But that doesn't rewrite the facts of the situation- that this distinction is correct.
Misunderstanding your enemy is never a good idea, as it's important to know what makes them tick. If they were all compliant fascists, that changes what kind of tactics are used to break their morale and even have a portion surrender, compared to being conscripts who don't even believe in what they're fighting for.
But it is my country