this post was submitted on 22 Oct 2023
-9 points (41.2% liked)

Linux

47237 readers
3343 users here now

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Linux is a family of open source Unix-like operating systems based on the Linux kernel, an operating system kernel first released on September 17, 1991 by Linus Torvalds. Linux is typically packaged in a Linux distribution (or distro for short).

Distributions include the Linux kernel and supporting system software and libraries, many of which are provided by the GNU Project. Many Linux distributions use the word "Linux" in their name, but the Free Software Foundation uses the name GNU/Linux to emphasize the importance of GNU software, causing some controversy.

Rules

Related Communities

Community icon by Alpár-Etele Méder, licensed under CC BY 3.0

founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
 

I'm wondering if a distro like the one I'm looking for even exists:

  • simple as in KISS and vanilla. This excludes Debian where the package manager is too complex and packages deviate from upstream too much, as well as OpenSUSE, where systems administration relies on GUI tools too much and the package manager is even more complex.
  • fixed release (excludes everything Arch-based)

So from the major distros, only Fedora is left as an option, where I really don't know enough about it. Is it possible to do a minimal install of it? Is it built around a GUI app store? Does it rely on Flatpak like Ubuntu does with Snap?

Or are there other distros out there that I'm not aware of? Basically everything from the past 5 years I have no experience with. I've heard good things about NixOS, but it sounds weird as a daily driver.

top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 35 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (6 children)

What on God's green flat earth are these requirements??

What about apt do you find too complex? I guess what are you defining as 'complex"?

I'm terms of package management you'll be hard pressed to find anything that requires less work that apt, yum, zypper or their various GUIs.

Debian is the most vanilla distro you can get and you are excluding it out of the gate because of apt. So it would be helpful for all of us to understand your complexity issues with apt (and zypper).

It was my first distro and I miss it a lot. Simplicity and stability are main selling points

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago
load more comments (5 replies)
[–] [email protected] 29 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

If you say Debian's and OpenSUSE's package manager are too complex for you, I can tell you that NixOS' package manager is definitely not for you.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 11 months ago (3 children)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 11 months ago

if Hannah Montana Linux is to complicated, then Uwuntu

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago

This is always correct.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 11 months ago

This excludes Debian where the package manager is too complex and packages deviate from upstream too much

This isn't even remotely true.

Also going with Debian + GNOME Software + Flatpak isn't a bad ideia at all. Unlike Snaps, Flatpaks are fast you won't notice delays and waste 10GB of RAM for each application you want to use. And at the end of the day you get rock solid Debian + the latest and greatest software as Flatpaks without "deviation from upstream" and you also keep a clean system.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 11 months ago

You've picked pretty stupid criteria, but if you're adamant on it, as another commenter said Slackware is probably one of the best options.

Fedora dances with Flatpak quite a bit, but you could double check if RHEL does (since that's what Fedora is based on).

Again, while Slackware (and possibly RHEL) fit your criteria, your criteria seems pretty silly, and you're likely to walk into bigger (and harder to solve) problems on more obscure platforms.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 11 months ago (1 children)

If apt is too complex for you, I don't know what to tell you...

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I feel like you're confusing "hard to use" with "complex".
Apt is extremely complex under the hood, which shows when you try to build a package for it, or install a package with many dependencies then remove it again, leaving traces behind, or when you break your system by using different front-ends (apt, apt-get, aptitude, synaptic) which are all included in the default installation, but handle dependencies differently.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago

Most modern package managers have that level of complexity tho... That dependency tracking can take a lot of computation.

Maybe a notable exception would be Slackware package manager, but you won't find what you'd expect from modern package manager (e.g. dependency resolving, autoremove package).

I find building packages with Gentoo to be much simpler than with Debian. Probably this is due to the fact that Gentoo users would regularly build their packages, unlike Debian.

I also learned Debian automatically generate dependency list by scanning the binaries of each package to see what dynamic libs it links. Bet that does add to the complexity by much.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 11 months ago (2 children)

On OpenSuse, sudo zypper install package-name

Not too complex if you ask me.

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 10 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

Slackware. It'll take a bit of getting used to but it meets your criteria.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago

I was going to say the same

[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago

I have the same recommendation, try slack out it really feets.

But I think it will be like Genie fullfiling your wishes - you don't really know what you are looking for, but it might really suit you.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 11 months ago (2 children)

How is apt too complex? And which is simple then?

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 6 points 11 months ago

Slackware is obvious choice, exactly what you are looking for.

It was my first distro and I miss it a lot. Simplicity and stability are main selling points.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago

OpenSUSE allows minimal installs. Should be possible to go with Leap or the new Slowroll and extend it without all the GUI tools to make your fixed release, KISS system.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago (1 children)

What's the complex part about "apt" or "zypper"?

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I haven't used it myself, and admittedly am entirely unfamiliar, but a buddy put popos on something recently and was talking about how smooth and simple it was. Might be worth a gander.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago (1 children)

PopOS is Debian based, which has apt as a package manager (OP no likey likey).

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago

Slackware is the solution then clearly.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago (1 children)

After a hiatus in Mac and windows land, I came back into Linux a with similar wishlist.

It's quite a diversion, but I actually went with FreeBSD. Now it's not Linux but with the separation of base system and packages, you get a stable base that is released at a pretty fixed consistent schedule.

For packages you can pick from quarterly or weekly update schedule, so you can have a stable base OS with bleeding edge software. The binary package manager is easy to use, but if you want more control you can opt for building from source as well.

The init system is BSD based so all main config goes into a single rc.conf file, very easy to understand and work with.

Most mainstream applications such as Firefox, postgresql, nginx etc are just a pkg install away and it natively supports zfs (even as root fs) which was one of the reasons I got really interested in it 10 years ago.

Of course, there is software, especially some younger projects that don't support FreeBSD. So while there are thousands of packages available, some Linux only applications won't work.

Personally, I would pick FreeBSD any time that the software I require supports it. I only run Linux (settled on pop is for now) if the software I need requires it.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago

Thank you for one of the few helpful answers in this thread.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 7 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Same package manager as Debian, isn't it? Which OP said is too complex.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago (1 children)

There's also GUI package manager, if you want to use that.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago

Which he also mentioned he doesn't like to depend on.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

Have you tried macos? Seriously though, in Debian you just type 'sudo apt install program,' that is about as simple as it gets. Also opensuse allows you to not install yast with like 2 clicks in the installer, and all the GUI tools are just wrappers for terminal tools that they also include. I am not saying this to be insulting, but I honestly don't think you know enough about Linux to know what you are looking for. If you do want to try Linux, just try a beginner distro like mint.

Edit: upon reading some comments, I see that you mean apt is complicated under the hood, not difficult to use. You could try gentoo if you don't mind long installs. It compiles from source so that is about as simple as package management gets.

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago
[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago

Void linux with its xbps package manager might match with your requirements.

Then solus with its eopkg package manager which I might wait like next year to try it.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago

It doesn't quite fit your fixed release requirement, but have you checked out void? It's like arch, but has no systemd and it's more stable then arch

[–] [email protected] 2 points 10 months ago

NixOS as a daily driver is really good

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago

Alpine Linux!

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Just... What? Just stick with Windows

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago

Debian apt repositories is too complex?!?

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago

I am 100% serious when I say pick one off of this list: https://www.gnu.org/distros/free-distros.html

load more comments
view more: next ›