this post was submitted on 25 Nov 2023
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[–] [email protected] 110 points 9 months ago (4 children)

The problem with a vehicle kill switch is the same problem as an encryption backdoor for law enforcement. It will leak, quickly (inside a year) and so not only will law enforcement misuse this power (history shows they've misused all powers they've been given) but nefarious interests will use it to cause havoc.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 9 months ago

one problem...

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[–] [email protected] 63 points 10 months ago (3 children)

First part to get ripped out of new cars

[–] [email protected] 61 points 9 months ago (4 children)

Might be more difficult than that. I'm in the hunt for a new work truck, a ram 2500. I'm specifically targeting a 2019-2020, because the 4G cellular module is easily removed, whereas in newer models it is soldered directly to a main telematics board and is pretty tricky to remove.

These companies don't want you removing these systems in their current state, as they're harvesting your data and selling it off as another revenue stream. I suspect these future monitoring systems, if removed, will brick the vehicle in one way or another.

[–] [email protected] 20 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

Just disconnect the antenna and/or cover the module with something that will block any wireless signals. It's easier upfront and simple to undo when you want to sell the vehicle.

It was my go-to solution whenever I bought a vehicle with OnStar.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

I suspect that like John Deere there will be a Ukrainian style hack that undermines this bullshit.

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[–] [email protected] 24 points 9 months ago (6 children)

Someone linked a nice explainer on the topic in this thread, but my takeaway was that this is unlikely to ever exist

TLDR of the TLDR (which I recommend reading)

  • the regulatory body is super slow, and won't approve a change unless all the ducks are in a row

  • there's no safe way to stop or disable a car while it's moving, so the regulatory body won't approve it anytime soon

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[–] [email protected] 16 points 9 months ago (1 children)

It will go in the scrap bin right next to the OnStar module.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 9 months ago

...but wait you don't love accidently talking to someone in Texas every time you go to turn your dome light off/on ?

[–] [email protected] 46 points 9 months ago (9 children)

Always check your sources…

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundation_for_Economic_Education

They literally gave an award to Charles Koch.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 9 months ago

Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.

They can be a source of egregious right wing propaganda undermining our democracy at every turn (which they are), and also occasionally still have legitimate grievances with our legislators sneaking bullshit like this into otherwise critical legislation.

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[–] [email protected] 43 points 9 months ago (3 children)

I sure hope I never get injured using my chainsaw out in the forest with no cell service. It's going to be so awesome bleeding out in a truck that cuts to 5mph max because I'm too busy holding the tourniquet on my leg while I drive. That's certainly NEVER happened. NEVER happens, to nobody, including my mother.

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[–] [email protected] 42 points 10 months ago (2 children)

If this becomes law, I will literally refuse to purchase any new cars. We have made a ton of current cars to have scrap parts for another 30-40 years

[–] [email protected] 24 points 10 months ago (4 children)

If the 2021 Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act, which was signed on Nov 15th, 2021 becomes law?

[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago

im disappointed

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[–] [email protected] 35 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I'm just waiting for the moment that this kill switch is hacked, and whole cities come to a complete standstill.

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[–] [email protected] 34 points 9 months ago (5 children)

So this isn't an external kill switch. It's far more likely to be a lane and driver monitoring system integral to the car itself.

The big problem is what do you do with a car that's stopped itself? Obviously you need emergency services, and obviously you can't depend on the passengers to call them. So the real effect here is to mandate the integration of vehicles into the emergency service networks so the car can call up dispatch.

I would say this is another brick in the argument for an open source car operating system that keeps the car offline and gives you the tools you want.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 9 months ago (4 children)

I would say this is another brick in the argument for an open source car operating system

...Go analog with a carb, maybe? Only thing that can stop a carb from working is it being out of gas. Or changing altitude. Or bad fuel. Or it's too cold and/or hot. ... OK lots of things can stop carbs, but the government sure can't, at least.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Jailbreaking cars will be the new software development in piracy. Just wait for someone to figure out a way to permanently disable this entire system.

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[–] [email protected] 33 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I see where they're coming from, but like every good idea the government has had its going to be abused and mutated into Satan's Christmas tree of a bill, and either be draconian or useless.

Also, this idea is shit for brains stupid lol

[–] [email protected] 27 points 9 months ago (6 children)

American solution to a problem of deadly car chases.

I guess „don’t chase cars” would be too simple.

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 9 months ago (1 children)

This is already a concerning power to hand to a government, which could cause issues regarding the right of freedom of movement. But even if we assume an ideal and responsible government that never misuses their powers, can we be sure such a backdoor would be secure enough not to be exploited by other parties?

[–] [email protected] 41 points 9 months ago (4 children)

No such thing as a secure backdoor

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 10 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (3 children)

There's no possible way this ever makes it to regulation. And most of you haven't read the law, so don't understand you're being lied to. Read analysis here:

https://midwest.social/comment/4975539

[–] [email protected] 32 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Looking at the other articles on the site, I count one antivaxx and another that claims the newly elected fascist in Argentina is a "Libertarian".

Thanks for linking to a sane review.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I literally downvoted before reading anything besides the title. An unknown publication making an outlandish claim. Obvious rage bait. It's sad to see so many of these nothing stories gain traction here. It's so fucking obvious.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

I think the analysis is correct in that the implementation will die in committee before ever making it to effect, not to mention the practical considerations of implementing this in the lighting-fast timeframe of 3 years. However, I cannot help but point out this part:

So far, not a kill switch, but some kind of technology to detect if you’re driving like a drunk person and disable the vehicle.

"Disable the vehicle" is literally what people mean when they talk about a "kill switch". At best that's an argument over semantics. The law mandates a thing that deliberately stop your car from functioning. That's a kill switch.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

It's not a lie. There's no malicious intent. It's just not even wrong. It so fundamentally lacks understanding of the underlying bureaucracy, technology, product lifecycle, and surrounding politics politics that it amounts to nothing.

And the overall point still stands. We should be skeptical of these kinds of intrusions into our devices from the state. We should resist them as a default posture.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 9 months ago

I'm sure we'll never find out that the kill switch was disproportionately used on people of color.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 9 months ago (12 children)

Can’t wait to patch that out, should be as fun as that dumbshit auto-shutoff they have now.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Next step will be to have it drive you to the police station and alert them of your arrival.

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